(Republican) Change I Could Believe In...

Comments

[this is good]

If only they would return to what they stood for for so many years. They have been hijacked by extremists and it will take allot of work to undo what has been done.

They may just do it if they want to survive or compete. They simply need to return for what they stood for for many, many years. That is change I could believe in.

One point I'd like to make, Toe-Knee, is the state of change the Republicans have gone through over the years so don't get too depressed with the current situation.

The religious right have waxed and waned in the party. It's fairly cyclical. The party (like any other) get desperate for support when they lose the plot and start looking for large groupings to shore up their position. The Fundamentalists as part of the religious vote see a chance to gain influence and clamour on board.

Eventually the party gets identified with the higher profile, more extreme, elements and the Voters and less extreme Christians get nervous and abandon the Party. Then they go back to basics and win general support.

The trick is to get the Palin-like folk out of the limelight so they can rebuild without the ghosts of the last trashing reminding everyone of their involvement. Currently the party appears to be in denial but eventually they will get there.

I'm amazed how closely it followed the Aussie experience except the Reps seem to be recovering faster. The Liberals here suffered exactly the same loss of fundamental principals as the Republicans.
Up in Canada the only fundamental principal the Liberals seem to uniformly have is entitlement. I'm a big believer in cycles in politics actually, but right now in the US I don't see either side pushing the Liberty and Freedom agenda, so I'm hoping maybe I can give one party a little push.
It's the same here on freedoms. The term Liberal suggests a party that values freedom yet Kevin 07's attempts to censor the Net has hardly caused a ripple in Aussie politics.

The Public is stirring at least.

Actually I have been trying to stir up the National Party over here via direct email. They are supposed to stand up for the country folk but they side with mining companies against farmers. Consequently they are disappearing as a party. Looks like they will die as a very financially viable party. Dumbies.
[this is good]

Sorry I'm not commenting nmore on this. I'm knee-deep in editing your other article for HS. It's a tough call which is better- this one or that....

How much editing does that one need? And this one is unfinished, I'd like to do up a better one for HS, this is the test run really.
It's done and off to the webmaster. Got great photos , too. Want me to send you an edited copy via email?
[this is good]
this is excellent, TK:) - i agree with all three of your main points - and concur with peter up there - if the Repubs can purge themselves of the super fundies, they might have a chance of getting their party back on track - whether that happens is a toss-up, though - and in rough economic times, it's generally the radical elements which manage to grab all the support, if only through rhetoric - gaahhhh - i don't know - my husband (an economist) likes to say he's washing his hands of it all since we will likely never live in the US anymore - i can't tear myself away, though
[this is good]
A few points I'd add to the conversation...

1. Socialism, at its root, is about balancing the power between laborer and executive and not about taking from the rich in order to give to the poor. That's a common misconception. The Robin Hood aspect came out of a misguided use of Socialist tenets. There would be no need to rob Peter to pay Paul if Peter didn't so magnificently subjugate Paul by fighting the minimum wage at every turn and refusing to grant benefits to employees while simultaneously taking home a notable fortune -- millions of dollars made off the sweat and sore backs of his low-paid workers.

2. Freedom is nice, but without Equality, it is a complete myth. If you disagree, consider your typical inner-city minority youth from an abusive and broken home. Does that kid really have the same chance to prosper as a kid born rich and white? Of course not. Why not? A decided lack of Equality. Freedom is non-existent to him because he hasn't the means to take advantage of it. Unfortunately, the solution has been to just hand him something to placate him instead of giving him what he needs to actually become equal.

Consider the stimulus package. It might have been good if the money alotted to local governments didn't get roundly nixed. By empowering state governments, the stimulus might have prompted a community-wide boost (the money would get spent and might even create some jobs), but they instead decided to give the boost only to those people who make enough to pay taxes. So schools don't get built and roads stay beat up, but I get $15 more on each paycheck. Lovely. That inner-city kid benefits not one iota.

3. George HW Bush once said atheists shouldn't be considered American citizens because the United States is a "nation under God". We aren't, of course, but that doesn't matter to the Religious Right. The words "under God" weren't added to the Pledge until 1954 and the message "In God We Trust" wasn't added to our money until the following year. There is every evidence that keeping religion out of government was precisdely what the Founding Fathers wanted. We have since failed them.
Consider the stimulus package. It might have been good if the money alotted to local governments didn't get roundly nixed. By empowering state governments, the stimulus might have prompted a community-wide boost (the money would get spent and might even create some jobs)...

I think that pretty well illustrates my biggest misgiving about the Democrats these days. They're to centralist orientated. They continue to consolidate more and more power, authority, and responsibility under one group, which in my mind just serves to make the rich even richer and the poor even further below them. Which is why I argue for Republicans to better define separation of various institutions as part of their party platform.
I'm interested in finding out your take on my Equality vs. Freedom notion. Do you agree the former must precede the latter?

I think it's a pipe dream to expect Republicans to put any effort at all into closing the gap between rich and poor. Indeed, championing the rich is how they get their power. That, and the deliberate ignorance of those who don't make enough to benefit from their agenda and yet vote for them.
I'm interested in finding out your take on my Equality vs. Freedom notion. Do you agree the former must precede the latter?

Actually no I don't. Equality is an illusion and not a very good one either because no one really believes that all people are equal. We can try to delude ourselves in saying as much but the best we can (and should) say is that all people must have equal potential.

An argument for true equality must include that a mentally retarded child rapist is just as entitled to everything in life as a nobel prize winning author. Which is a stupid argument that no one will make. However an argument that all people are FREE to pursue whatever dream they can and come of it what may is the argument for equal potential.

To have equal potential you must have freedom first.

To have true equality means that one side has to equal the other which means you must remove some from the greater half to make them equal which robs the greater half of the freedom to be whatever it will. This is the opposite of freedom.

That's where I stand.
Cool, thanks. I was about to rebut, but it's pretty clear we just have a different view of what "freedom" actually is. Of course, we don't have things like socialized medicine here in the U.S. like you have up there, so perhaps there are mitigating factors to each of our opinions that the other cannot know. For the majority of Americans, Freedom is every bit as illusory as you believe Equality to be. Trust me.
My statement is based on non-absolutes. I've never contended that absolute freedom is possible or even good (we're confined by things like gravity and ethics after all), though I do contend that more freedom is usually preferable to less. But my methods aren't always typical. For example, in the health care example you bring up I believe that Socialist health care should absolutely exist, but it should be balanced by private health care, such a system exists in Australia, and it offers the most freedom of the three options for all people. The trick is in balancing the ambition and greed of the health-care professionals with the needs of the people. This of course is limiting the providers which is taking some of their freedom, but if they're still given the ability to exercise that ambition and greed then theoretically their potential yield is still without limit so I don't see them as being not free.

Freedom to me is the right of all people to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, some have those rights less than others, and it's my belief that we should work to keep them for ourselves and look to ways to enhance other's lives as well. If that opinion differs from yours then I guess we must disagree.

"Freedom to me is the right of all people to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, some have those rights less than others, and it's my belief that we should work to keep them for ourselves and look to ways to enhance other's lives as well. If that opinion differs from yours then I guess we must disagree."

I guess maybe the disconnect is in the definition of "rights" then? I don't see the exploitation practiced by the wealthy in this country as a "right". The "pursuit of happiness" shouldn't involve the deliberate subjugation of others, but that sort of practice is not only acceptable it's fucking encouraged! I got to pay the health care for Wal*Mart employees because Wal*Mart execs, in their pursuit of happiness, decided they wouldn't bother providing it. More money for them. Happiness pursued and gained! That's since changed, but no one can seem to tell my why it was OK for so long.

Thing is, an idea is an easy thing. It's when the absolute examples of that idea are examined that we are able to see the real world effects. I can make a case for just about anything if I remain in the abstract.

As a side note, I think it's funny how everyone says human greed is the downfall of Socialism when it's quite obvious the free market fails us as a direct result of unchecked avarice.
Unchecked capitalist monopolies tied with the government are functionally exactly the same as socialism. Which is why in my post I advocated that Republicans need to shift to a policy of corporate oversight rather than taxation. I'm employed as a result of that oversight here in Canada so I absolutely believe it's a good thing. Corporations in Canada all willingly enact triple the safety guidelines that any industrial entity in the states would even consider because in Canada we have a law that says if an employer does not provide a safe work environment that results in an individuals death, then the people who own the corporation can be charged with CRIMINAL negligence. That would be like if a wal-mart employee is forced to sweep a parking lot with inadequate lighting and security and that employee is mugged and killed, the Waltons would come up on criminal charges and possibly go to jail.

I don't see such a law infringing on anyones rights or freedoms, it doesn't tax anyone more, it doesn't limit the Walton's ability to make money by setting the prices they choose or paying their employees what they want to. However it does ensure that the employees are guaranteed a safe work environment here in Canada.

So when you say : "I don't see the exploitation practiced by the wealthy in this country as a "right". The "pursuit of happiness" shouldn't involve the deliberate subjugation of others, but that sort of practice is not only acceptable it's fucking encouraged!" I don't see any of that to do with right's and freedoms at all, that's to do with oversight, which I mentioned in this blog is something I absolutely condone and want to see more of.

The danger is when people see a lack of oversight and think that the only solution is to limit freedoms in order to remedy it. Enacting policies based on that mindset only puts more control in the hands of the powerful in the long run.
So, then, at what point do regulation and oversight cross the line into the territory of government dictating how you live your life? I want the former and not the latter but history suggests Republicans are incapable of understanding anything but polar extremes.

I believe you and I are on the same page with regard to what every citizen should have access to in a model society, but I think the party responsible for things like removing the very regulations that helped control the housing market would have absolutely no interest in oversight of any kind. Indeed, it is antithetical to everything they believe.

If you really expect any oversight, you'll want to remain liberal and not look to the right for even a split-second. Regulation is decidedly a liberal affair. Here are the words of famed liberal economist Robert Kuttner from 2007 which I think back up my claim quite well (emphasis is mine):

"...today, whenever the speculative excesses lead to a crash, the Fed races to the rescue. ...it bails out the speculative system, so that the next round of excess can proceed. And somehow, this is scored as trusting free markets, overlooking the plain fact that the Fed is part of the U.S. government...

"...If you are a complete believer in the proposition that free markets are self-regulating and self- correcting, then you logically should let markets live with the consequences. On the other hand, if you are going to rescue markets from their excesses, on the very reasonable ground that a crash threatens the entire system, then you have an obligation to act pre-emptively... to head off highly risky speculative behavior. Otherwise, the Fed just invites moral hazards and more rounds of wildly irresponsible actions...

"Sarbanes-Oxley has been attacked in some quarters as harmful to the efficiency of financial markets. One good thing about the sub-prime calamity is that we haven't heard a lot of that argument lately. Yet there is still a general bias in the administration and the financial community against regulation."

A bias in the Bush administration and the financial sector against regulation!? Imagine that!

Republicans hate having their duplicitous schemes limited by regulation. In fact, that might be the single largest reason the party has evolved so revoltingly into NeoConservatism.
So, then, at what point do regulation and oversight cross the line into the territory of government dictating how you live your life?

My ideal scenario to implement is this: (Understand that I don't have law training so I'm just shooting in the dark here. Real lawyers would probably be much better at defining my concepts. ) If an individual or group's actions clearly victimize another, then the first step should be to provide a framework for those parties to come to a resolution without conflict. If that is impossible, then the law needs to create a framework to punish the victimizing actions and implement a way of enforcing the law. Libertarianism isn't anarchy, and while some libertarians would disagree with me, I believe the structure of a law should bend towards protecting the people from being victimized. Laws that follow that procedure don't pull individual rights and freedoms or compromise the potential of equality.

As to whether or not the GOP is capable of adopting a regulatory stance in their policies is up for debate. I'd actually hoped for a few conservatives to chime in here and let me know what they thought as far as it being viable or something they'd support. Unfortunately most of the bloggers who like what I write are more left-of-center politically, so I don't think many of the conservatives read it.

"As to whether or not the GOP is capable of adopting a regulatory stance in their policies is up for debate."

Sure, but their idea of "free market" means "free of all regulation," which is what I'm basing my admittedly bombastic claim on. :)

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Toe-Knee
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